Kevin Steele Forced Out at Clemson
by DrB on Jan 12, 2012 12:23 PM EST
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Two years ago Derek Dooley and Tennessee came after Kevin Steele and Clemson upped the ante to keep him here, but now he's out. We have no idea whether he has found another LB job (Green Bay is a possibility) or if he actually wishes to retire, but his office has been cleaned out before Dabo even returned from the AFCA convention.
We have looked at a few guys as possible replacements for Steele that we'd think would fit and could be talked into coming here: Jim Heacock from Ohio State (situation is in flux there), Bob Shoop from Vandy, Tom Bradley at Penn State, Chuck Heater from Temple (formerly Co-DC at Florida), Pat Narduzzi from Michigan State (unlikely as he just renegotiated), and Bill Clark from South Alabama. Randy Shannon had had a deal in place with Tennessee that fell through due to Shannon wanting a multi-year deal, but he is a possibility.
We have heard several disturbing things about Steele's possible psychological breakdown during the Orange Bowl game. Multiple sources have said that he was calling plays from his days with the Panthers, which aren't in the Clemson playbook, and as such the players were totally confused. It reportedly happened during the Auburn game as well. I do not know if that is true, and frankly think it a bit farfetched, but I do know that Steele has a reputation for being a nervous wreck on gamedays. I'm sure most of you recall that he passed out on the sidelines during a game, and I have heard many times that he requires an IV for fluids because he's such a wreck and won't eat at all on gameday. Hopefully he can get these things corrected for his own health.
For whatever reason, his inability to simplify his scheme for the players this year became the primary problem with Clemson's defense, which had been Top 25 the last two seasons. We do not believe Clemson has been as hampered by poor LB talent as many folks believe. I think even good players look like crap when they're too confused and haven't worked on fundamentals enough. We wish him luck in the future because we do think he has been a good coach over his career.
As you see, if the ducks quack loud enough, things happen. As for recruiting impact this weekend, I think it is going to be minimal unless we have a total philosophic shift on defense, and with Dabo's preference for tight coverage and pressure, I doubt that happens. Steele was not the chief recruiter for our defensive commitments this cycle.
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In other news, Batson STILL has a job.
Y’all really need that one fixed…
If Dabo fires Batson
I will change my opinion of Dabo and believe him to be a decent head coach.
What are you glorifying with your life?
I often wondered about his temperment
After seeing a video I believe with him and Heather Dinich, in which he basically outlined his film routine and gameday routine, it just didn’t seem healthy at all and I wondered how someone who appeared to never sleep could ever focus when it came down to gamedays.
All in all, I was a huge Steele fan until this year, I think he is solid against pro-style schemes, which is becoming virtually non-existent in this conference. I wish him the best! But am seriously hoping for an upgrade. I await your posts after the candidates are named and a hire is made.
"Just because you've had 2 or 3 good games doesn't mean anything right now. It's not the first 3 games you're going to be remembered by." - The Chad
Good Luck To Steele
Steele is a decent, hardworking and likeable guy. The health issues are disturbing and I hope he gets them taken care of soon.
Footballwise, it needed to happen. The whole direction of the defense seemed to be going from bad to worse.
firing Steele means nothing...
… if they keep Batson as S&C. the softness of our players is way worse than our putrid D. get a new S&C coach and we might be a pretty good team next year, finally!
There are a lot of good options out there
its important we get one of them.
This defense has some talent, it just needs good coaching and less confusion.
by ggggmen08 on Jan 12, 2012 1:07 PM EST via Android app reply actions
Can we realistically tempt one of the coaches form another university?
I would like Shannon personally. The fact that he wants a multi year deal is fine with me.
I don't want Shannon.
I believe I heard he was one of the ones orchestrating the pay for play scam at the U before he took over as head coach. He mya be a good DC, but there are other options that are just as good without the baggage.
"Clemson is coming!" - Stephone Anthony
by Tigerplowboy on Jan 12, 2012 1:24 PM EST up reply actions
The pay for play stuff is a good point to bring up
Clemson has traditionally run the opposite direction when dealing with people that could possibly violate NCAA rules. Seems like they would do the same with Shannon
Ahh I remember that now
if it’s true then you’re right. We don’t want such a thing coming up at Clemson.
Shannon is a great coordinator, who has problems handling Jimbo
Could be a win win for our schools.
You guys get top 15 defenses……that can’t stop FSU.
#tonguefirmlyincheek
I'm with you, Tigerplowboy
I’m not a big Shannon fan.
I wonder if Tom Bradley would like to come and coach down in the south.
I don't have a problem with Tom Bradley from PSU.
They had no choice to clean house, so his getting canned had nothing to do with his coaching ability. Also, I have not read anything that indicates he knew about the Sandusky mess.
I do think Randy Shannon would be a great fit at Tennessee!
"Clemson is coming!" - Stephone Anthony
by Tigerplowboy on Jan 12, 2012 3:22 PM EST up reply actions
Marion Hobbie was the former DC at Duke
I imagine he would be a good promotion from within, also has been in the ACC for long enough and is more of a recruiter than Steele is. Only question would will we be getting more of the same? Dabo can not bring in someone else in who will be unable to stop spread offenses.
Don't give up, don't ever give up ~ Jim Valvano
Not to belittle what just happened to Steele but
it’s kind of exciting in one sense looking for a new DC. It feels kind of like shopping for a new car. I could get on board with Bill Clark.
I'm sick of sucking lemons.
In a few months, when the smell wears off, you worry less about the paint job and more about getting from point A to point B.
DrB, what are your thoughts on Bill Clark at S. Alabama?
I’ve heard several people mention him, but I’m not very familiar with his work. Would you prefer to go with someone “up and coming” like him supposedly or someone more established such as a Tom Bradley or Randy Shannon.
Best of luck to Coach Steele.
Agree
The reason I was happy when Steele came on board was that we were finally implementing a more aggressive scheme compared to Koenning. It showed with the increase in turnovers and TFL, the prior defenses wouldn’t lose you a game and held opponents from scoring in bunches but never seemed to make a big play, especially on third down. However anything is better than the mess we saw this year.
Steele is well regarded and has a long resume
But for whatever reason, that did not translate on the field this past season.
Almost all of the time, our players appeared confused and out of position. They could not execute the basic fundamental stuff, like tackling. Oftentimes they really looked like they had never played defense before.
In addition, Steele was the LB coach, and our LBs have not played well as a group.
Ultimately the responsibility for fielding a defense that looks like they have played defense before rests with the DC. He did not get it done this past season. I don’t know how much of that falls oon the “co-DC” Harbison who we never hear a word about.
I can’t celebrate this too much until I see what his replacement can do.
I know we have sufficient talent and quality of players on defense to have a better defense than what we saw this past year.
And please God, let us get a guy who can teach peopel how to stop option and running QBs, cause we have not done that for years.
Morris seems like a step in the right direction (so far) -he is certainly being paid like he is. Hopefully we can get somone in who can run a competent defense.
Need a new LB coach now too
Levon Kirkland anyone?
Already coaching a middle school
from w hat I’ve heard. Jeff Davis is still free though. Let him do it.
Clemson's fallen way down if they can't hire him away from a middle school
by Braap on Jan 12, 2012 2:22 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Just saying that he might be bound by a contract right now
also, while a great player, he really doesn’t have any experience in terms of coaching. I’d roll the dice on him personally, because he’s a really cool guy, I know him pretty well.
I think
we can buy out a middle school contract
by PenthouseTiger on Jan 12, 2012 9:10 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
In this economy?
“Clemson University and Cooter Burger Jr. Middle School in heated battle over possible Linebackers Coach/Gym Teacher/Hall Monitor”
Ultimately Clemson will buy out the contract for ten crates of Grade L Chocolate Milk. Deal falls through after Dabo drinks all the chocolate milk while driving to make the delivery.
Jeff Davis
I think Jeff Davis is helping set up a church. He came to Clemson Presbyterian and talked about it during the fall
by Spencer York on Jan 12, 2012 3:28 PM EST up reply actions
I know
I was a member of his church for four years and have a good relationship with he and his family. Still, he works with the football team, in more of an advisory role I think. So I don’t think it would be too difficult for him to also coach up the LBs. At worst, he could allow the assistane paster, Paster Mitch to talk over a majority of the load for the church
Kirkoland may have been a great LB, but that does nto mean he is a great LB coach
He may or may not be – I don’t know. But a good player on the field does not always make a good coach. We need a good coach, even if he was a 160 lb bench warmer as a player.
About the only thing I remember about Kirkland...
In college, he’d run wind sprints during his free-time. So, at least, he had a good work ethic. He’s now a HS coach.
Not that I have a problem with Levon Kirkland
but I do want to see how well he can coach where he is.
Steele Sacrificed...
So that Batson isn’t. Besides, there’s an unwritten county ordinance protecting Clemson’s S&C under-performer:
“In Pickens County thou shalt not terminate any Batson employed by Clemson University, under penalty of law…or worse.”
by TopTwentyPonziScheme on Jan 12, 2012 3:08 PM EST reply actions
I heard that we might be able to not so much fire Baston
so much as we could move him to another position.
I'm going to state the obvious here...
and say that it’s ridiculous that you can’t fire someone that deserves to be fired. Every single one of us knows that if he does get moved aside, it’s because he was doing a terrible job. How can he just sit there in a cozy office collecting a pay check when every fan knows he deserves to be fired? If I was in Batson’s position and I knew someone was trying to move me aside because they couldn’t fire me because of nepotism, I would have enough pride to resign. But that’s just me.
Same here
unfortunantly that doesn’t seem to be the feeling that he has. Fact is that it’s not what you know it’s WHO you know. And if everyhting I’ve heard about Baston is right then he knows some important people that seem to have his back. He’s the common demominator and has been for years. If Dabo can find a way to, if not fire him, get him out of the way and bring in some fresh, new talent at the S&C position, then I’ll truly believe that we’re ready for big things.
god good help them if he was calling carolina panthers defensive plays...
by sendthemtotheGRAVE on Jan 12, 2012 3:23 PM EST reply actions
TigerNet (which seems to be in cahoots with the AD's PR Dept.) published an article hyping up Bill Clark, and nobody else, so it seems likely that he'll get the job.
TigerNet published the same kind of hype before the hiring of Dabo & Morris so I think that the Clark-hiring is probably already in process.
http://www.tigernet.com/view/story.do?id=10300
El Cheapo
Must be the bargain our AD is looking for….. just like Dabo.
cheap or not
Dabo might have been a cheap hire but he ain’t cheap now.
However in 3 years we have won the division 2 and the ACC once. I would liek to see what the next 3 under Dabo brings. I would be satisfied with 2 more division win and 1 more ACC win in the next 3 years. I do not expect us to win more than 8 or 9 games next year. A lot of rebuilding is needed on the OL and DL. By the end of the season we should be able to beat the gamecocks at home though!
I wouldn't be disapointed by that
But wouldn’t be all that happy either unless the ACC steps up as a whole. While I still think that Steele has a good defensive mind I’m wondering if he’s losing a step or the game is passing him by. Dabo may lead practices that are too soft but that is no excuse for the completely missed assignments and confusion which has been rampant since he got here. Last year our D-line could be DOMINANT against anybody and it covered up some of the problems in my opinion. With the talent last year we should have been ahead of anything Koenning put on the field statistically but we weren’t.
I hope Steele finds a job in the NFL somewhere, guys there can commit the time needed to learn all his nuances and against the more traditional offenses you see there he could be successful. I think the college game with the spread has simply passed him by as his answer seemed to be take old school approach and complicate it to the 10th degree.
Even Strelow is saying what I said on twitter days ago
that Caldwell wishes to leave and Herb Hand is likely candidate.
Is it philosophical
As in practice mentality or is it more that Morris wants more fit athletic guys who can fit his scheme or possibly that they just don’t get along?
Tigernet reporting
that Caldwell AND Batson are not going anywhere… SERIOUSLY?!?! They’re going to keep this guy around?! Please tell me you have a better source than T-Net, DrB!!!
I dont see it
I do not want Caldwell gone. Caldwell can coach and I want him to stay. Its not his fault that Joey is a do-nothing.
But Joey is probably not getting fired outright, not with his Uncle on the BOT.
Is there enough time to hire a new DC as well as a new S&C
in time for spring ball? How soon could we expect to see the benefits of a new and improved S&C coach? I know you’ve said they have access 24/7 so could our lines really be tougher and in better shape by this fall?
Better shape yes
Need training table done to really pack on muscle
by DrB on Jan 12, 2012 8:50 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
In all honesty
Batson may be a good strength coach I don’t really know though I have serious doubts. He probably does technically know how to make guys stronger but today there is so much more to S&C than pumping weights and benching 500lbs. Part of me wants to claim that programs like Bama and Stanford last year have a secret sauce or more accurately juice and we just won’t go that far nor should we.
Consipiracy theories aside I feel his biggest problem is motivating guys and getting them to actually work hard and buy in to a strict diet / lifestyle. Any chance we just change his resposibilities and add more staff to handle every aspect of S&C other than weightlifting?
If his program is the one out there on the internet
They’re simply not training the right way. At best, Batson would be making beach bodies.
What’s scary is most of this is common knowledge if you go to a reputable website/strength forum.
So from one Vandy OLC to the the next?
Is Vandy the new fertile coaching tree to pick from? While I don’t know why you guys like Caldwell, I agree that one season is too soon to give him the blame. A sacrificial head had to roll. This year it was Steele. Is that enough? Granted, this may be solely Caldwell’s choice.
Get Randy Shannon!
Randy Shannon’s Miami Defenses (while DC) were consistently stellar. He developed players well and would make a great addition at Clemson.
by ZorroFonzarelli on Jan 12, 2012 9:00 PM EST reply actions
If he was for real calling Panthers plays that would explain a lot.
I didn’t follow the inner workings of any team at all before this season and now very little so I had no idea about his health problems. I do hope he gets those solved..that is very sad to hear about.
Who needs affection when you can have blind hatred?
Future Mrs. David Freese ♥
St. Louis Cardinals 2011 World Series Champions
I cant believe that caldwell and batson both are staying
“source” (aka Don Munson) inside the AD says neither one is leaving.
We'll see if its the same after signing day
by DrB on Jan 12, 2012 9:27 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
That's true. Don't wanna shake things up too much
Plus the news seems to be more about Caldwell than batson anyway. Batson is just mentioned as a side note…
by PapaCinco on Jan 13, 2012 8:48 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Why wld Caldwell stay. Isn’t he a zone blocking guy, & Morris wants gap blocking? If there r any “differences”, thats it, nothing personally betwewn them. But if something wasnt done with Baston along with Steele, nothing must be gonna happen. Why wldnt it b announced all at same time? Im not a big Dabo guy so far, but Baston may b outta his control. May not b “allowed” to fire or even “reassign” him even if h he wanted. But, as said earlier, if I was in his shoes, knowing everyone wanted me out, and only reason I was still around was my “powerful” uncle, my pride wldnt let me stay. I’d have to step aside.
by TigerFan74 on Jan 12, 2012 9:40 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Email Dabo
Here is the email listed for Dabo Swinney’s PR guy Munson. wmunson@clemson.edu
I encourage everyone here to get everyone you know to email that sad fucks and let them know you will not give Clemson one more fucking dime until they get this useless mound crap Batson out of there. Blow the email up. Maybe they will get the point.
by Boilingspringstiger on Jan 12, 2012 10:38 PM EST reply actions
S&C
I am a trainer at a medium sized gym…I know more about S&C that Batson, hands down… I’ll work for half his salary and KICK some butt!!!
ffffffuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu
“sources close to the program say Batson to stay put” ie Clemson to remain soft and pathetic… and to be continued to be pushed around by DII opponents and EVERYONE ELSE THEY PLAY!
Strength Coach is Barker's Call...
…TDP merely acting as his proxy. Not Dabo’s.
Which is not surprising, considering that the Three Pillars of the Barker management formula are: Political Correctness, Nepotism and Unaccountability, i.e., bureaucratic mismanagement on steroids.
by TopTwentyPonziScheme on Jan 13, 2012 9:35 AM EST reply actions
Dabo is now defending Batson in his presser
“That is a joke.Crap like that…people make insane statements. Batson is as good a strength coach as there is”
Write it down folks. Dabo will be gone in two years and this is the reason why.
Talk about sticking your head in the sand. I have tried to support Dabo but I’ll be damned if this is worth supporting.
So for the next two years we’re going to get pushed off the LOS by every single team we play, regardless of how many 5 star recruits we bring in. But our players will be able to bench 250lbs and they’ll get fat and lazy throughout the season.
DABO, for the sake of your job and your fat paycheck, fire this lazy bum and take a page from Urban Meyer’s handbook, hire a real S&C coach. If not, good luck in future endeavors because you’re certainly going to be looking for a new job after the 2013 season.
But I'm sure that lazy fatass of an excuse for our S&C coach
will still have his job.
I didn't expect Dabo to blast Baston live
just as he didn’t with Steele. If you look at what he said closely, he said that this guy is great at what he does and respected all over the country. The respected part is actually true as current and former Pro players, as well as coaches around the country respect and speak highly of the guy. However, I don’t recall Dabo coming out and saying that Baston is def a lock. I expect, like DrB, that Baston will be pushed into a more admin position with great accolades and yada yada to appease him and the BOT. If that doesn’t happen, then I’m with you and Dabo is in trouble.
Jesus, cant believe what I just heard! Baston is def staying
by TigerFan74 on Jan 13, 2012 12:33 PM EST via mobile reply actions
We need LSU freek
to do a GIF with Batson and the Charmin teddy bear.
Continuing the Batson Q's
Why does no one think that Batson could make adjustments either by himself or with pressure from the other coaches? I’m not trying to drink the orange Kool-aid, but if we are stuck with him I’d like to at least have some hope.
I’d be in favor of R. Shannon. He was clearly in over his head as a HC, but he was a pretty good DC at Miami, and adding a Florida recruiter is never a bad idea. And from what I understand, he was not in on Nevin Shapiro’s dealings, in fact the exact opposite, considered the guy bad news and explicitly instructed players to have nothing to do with him. The Miami basketball coach on the other hand, seems to have been pretty tight with Shapiro.
GO SPURS GO!
venerables
Shannon or Clark both seem better than venerables from what I’veread.
Venerables
like you said, I think he is an average DC and we just got rid of one so ?? His teams traditionally give up huge yardage and points, like every other team in the Big 12.
I don't want Venables
The Oklahoma fan base isn’t exactly in love with the guy, and their defense this year was pretty weak. I don’t know why we keep going back to him; didn’t he interview for the HC job when Dabo got it?? I’m not a fan of Venables.
Anyone else think this is probably Dabo’s most important offseason as our HC? He has raised the bar for himself, and will now have two coordinators that he hand picked. Not to mention virtually everyone on the field will be products of his recruiting.
by judge jeff davis on Jan 13, 2012 7:01 PM EST up reply actions
Gurley - a trend??
We lose Bullard, Gurley and Mike Davis to USuC…. is the luster off the Golden Boy?
Gurley also was under the assumption that Ellington was going pro immediately.
Like Dr. B said, Gurley wants (and almost expects) to play a lot this upcoming season and with Crowell’s issues to date, believes that he can be the man at UGA. Clemson is deeper at running back, especially with AE coming back and IF Bellamy can pull it together.
Clemson Sports Analysis and Insight
www.shakinthesouthland.com
Follow me on Twitter @figurefour_sts
I think the bowl game was hugely impactful
No one wanted to be a part of that. I’m sure other schools were telling recruits “oh, you don’t want to go to Clemson, they’re soft, blah blah” and then the bowl game was very evident of that.
I don’t think we ever had a real chance with Mike Davis, though. The more I hear the more it seems like he just didn’t want to be compared to James at all. Gurley and Bullard were probably leaning to their schools anyway, and probably wanted to play in the SEC, too. I do think though that with Gurley the bowl game was especially damaging. I don’t have any ‘inside info’ for this, just a gut feeling.
by judge jeff davis on Jan 13, 2012 6:59 PM EST reply actions
Yes, I agree with that
and Clemson was so late on all of these RBs that you can’t really blame them. We didnt put any effort to Marshall, gurley, or Mike Davis until here at the end of recruiting.
We even said here that we didnt expect Clemson to have room for a back in Summer, they werent pushing for any of them til Bellamy misbehaved and Buice left.
Ellington
coming back is huge so i don’t think it was as bad a loss as bullard. we needed him in the worst way.
I see that lewis is transferring but still don’t have a feel for the final # we will sign.
i’d rather focus on the coaching staff, s&c more than any more recruits at this point anyway.
What about Bullard?
I heard that he wouldn’t qualify and would have had to go to a junior college. Is this the case?
I honestly don't think Batson is going anywhere
Dabo seemed really stubborn on that one. I was unaware that Jaworski and Gruden were so impressed by the physiques of our players…that seemed a little embellished to me. Hell, I remember sitting fairly low to the field a couple of years ago and Virginia Tech looked like the varsity and we looked like the JV. I’d say UVA and VT have more physically ‘imposing’ players; at least UVA did when they had Wali Lundy, Heath Miller, etc. Not sure what games Gruden and Jaws had been watching, but LSU/Bama looked a little different than us, too.
Maybe Dabo was overselling it and changes will be made, but I have my doubts.
by judge jeff davis on Jan 13, 2012 7:39 PM EST reply actions
Doesnt' matter what they look like
Earlier in this thread I made the most pro Batson comment you will ever see, it was somehwhat toungue in cheek as I have no real inside info to what his trainign is like and don’t believe I could from internet videos. However what I do know is what it takes to make strength and the difference between body builders and athletes.
I am not a gifted genetic specimen like most of our players are. However I played in a highschool program with a GREAT strength and conditioning program. I was a feared individual by my senior year and my genetics would dictate that I should be a runt for my age group. Football strength is completely different from weightlifting strength, in those days I would embarrass bodybuilders with 100lbs on me in a strength showing, though your eyes may tell a different story. Explosive power lifts and plyometrics(sp?) are what build functional strength, not bench and leg presses. Moving a guy off the line of scrimmage has nothing to do with how much you can slowly bench, its all to do with leverage which is gained through the first explosive move off of the line. Power rules over force from a physics perspective, same applies to getting off of blocks. Our guys do not have this and the same training which develops it will not allow you to get fat. Dabo is a dumb arse if his latest comments RE Batson are sincere, however given his recent history for hirings and firings I wonder if it goes deeper than that, the one thing I give him credit for is running the program like a business and curious how batson is not held to the same standard???
Okay I want to be clear on this
does Dabo have the authority to fire Baston? I heard yes and sometimes I heard no so DrB, FigureFour which is it?
Yes he has the authority to make a change
by DrB on Jan 13, 2012 9:29 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Thanks
was tired of hearing conflicting things about this. Is he right though? Is Baston widely considered a good S&C coach? And if so is his problem the same as Steele’s in that he’s great at what he knows but can’t adjust to the way the game has changed?
I see the best teams with olympic training/hatch regimens
And i see ours gain fat over a season, or never be able to gain, or never move guys smaller than they are, so i say hes wrong.
Even if his system works, the motivation to do better isnt there all offseason, and the one that has contact all offseason is Joey Batson.
by DrB on Jan 13, 2012 9:56 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
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